Conundrum

Discussion in 'Dallas - The Original Series' started by Sarah, Oct 28, 2016.

  1. Sarah

    Sarah Super Moderator Staff Member Original Member Since 1998

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    I am watching Conundrum and apart from
    the fact I want to bash the sheer living crap (day lights) out of Sue Ellen's agent, I wondered who you have the most empathy for in these 2 final episodes??

    Bobby's story breaks my heart in these final episodes and Cally's story is gut wrenching too.

    Interesting that those who were most significant in JRs life (aside from Sue Ellen and Bobby) - Cliff - did the best in life without him. Ray didn't do too badly either and had the family he always wanted.

    Jason is a hateful twat of the highest order but even with the hatred he can only wish he has what it takes to be JR Ewing. Whatever you say about JR, I've always believed he has feelings deep down - something Jason in these episodes doesn't display.

    Of course although I sort of hate to admit it, my heart aches for JR who has successfully driven everyone away (especially Sue Ellen obviously). Seeing him on the verge of suicide was very hard to watch. Having said that I hate that Devil Spawn Adam for encouraging JR to shoot himself. Fek aff Adam and stop
    ruining my childhood.

    What do you think about these final
    episodes and who do you wish had been featured with regards to who JR impacted and why?

    I find it a shame that Miss Ellie wasn't in this - although all due respect to Barbara - but I do wonder how Miss Ellie's life would have been different without JR as her son. I'm sure there are thoughts about Pam, Lucy and others.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2016
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  2. Treeviewer

    Treeviewer Soap Chat Dream Maker

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    To tell the truth I didn't care what happened to any of them. Unlike season 9 we knew this was fantasy from the beginning. It was interesting from an academic standpoint but went on too long.
     
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  3. Don Howard

    Don Howard Soap Chat Fan

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    I'd have liked to see Barbara Bel Geddes back as Miss Ellie married to Steve Forrest as Jock Ewing with an appearance by Victoria Principal as Pam. Since Vicky P. required a document that decreed this would be the Last Dallas EVAR!, that would have signaled to the audience that this indeed was it.
     
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  4. azDallas

    azDallas Soap Chat Member

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    it was an interesting episode in that some people were better off without J.R., more of them a lot worse off. the ending was just too bad for me that it left the audience hanging for 5 years.
     
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  5. Karin Schill

    Karin Schill Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I really wish they had wrapped up Dallas in a proper way instead of giving us this nonsense.
    I remember feeling most sorry for Bobby and also Cally when I originally watched it as their lives seemed to suck the most without JR.
     
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  6. southfork88

    southfork88 Soap Chat Addict

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    Dallas-356-357-S14xE22-23--Conundrum Part I and Part II--May 03, 1991 0429.jpg

    Adam ... the angelic Diable !
     
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  7. TomParks2016

    TomParks2016 Soap Chat Fan

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    The episode before was much better, and could have been a 2 hour special
     
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  8. Presea

    Presea Soap Chat Addict

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    I really enjoyed seeing Bobby as a pathetic loser in Conundrum. But that was really the only good thing here. Although the Ray and Kristin parts were kind of nice. I don't know how much JR not being born would affect Katherine, but it would have been cool to see her in this. I would have liked to see her as the head of Wentworth Industries due to never having met Pam and Cliff. Then, Bobby the loser would beg Katherine for some money and a place to crash, and she would simply laugh at him and tell him to get lost!
     
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  9. Sarah

    Sarah Super Moderator Staff Member Original Member Since 1998

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    If this is true, What right did she have to say this? It's things like this that really annoy me about her. 'One requires a document to make the final decision about everyone else's lives'. Get over yourself love!
     
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  10. KayLloyd

    KayLloyd Soap Chat Fan

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    I've never read or heard anything to indicate that a "decree document" was demanded of the producers. My understanding is that Victoria asked for a commitment from the producers to provide closure for Pam and Bobby if she agreed to play Pam one last time in what they 99.999% knew would be the final episode and they foolishly refused her request. She made a reasonable request, and the producers blew a huge ratings bonanza and the chance to make fans happy because they let let their anger at her for leaving the show cloud their business judgement.
     
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  11. KayLloyd

    KayLloyd Soap Chat Fan

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    To my knowledge, it isn't true. CBS's decision about the fate of the show was already at the very least unofficially written on the wall, so honoring her request for the sake of loyal fans would not have changed the outcome for the cast and crew one single bit. Just some minor script rewrites, that's all.
     
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  12. Sarah

    Sarah Super Moderator Staff Member Original Member Since 1998

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    I hope it's not true. It paints her in a very bad light if it is.
     
  13. lbf522

    lbf522 Soap Chat Active Member

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    Cliff Barnes being Vice President and then President of the US? True JR did derail Cliff's ambitions but he helped as well by letting his ego overdue his commonsense.
     
  14. Rove

    Rove Soap Chat Star

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    By this stage I was viewing Dallas on a casual basis. I decided to watch this final episode more so out of loyalty than anything else. What a major disappointment and embarrassment to the brand. Appalling from beginning to end. How did the writers/producers believe this was quality viewing television?

    I now enjoy a love/hate relationship with Dallas and it's delivered in 3 Acts. The first act? Love everything up to "End Game" (when Bobby gets shot). The second act involves the Donna Reed debacle, the introduction of Jenilee Harrison and everything that is post "Dream Season", including the reunion movies. The third act? TNT Dallas. I now view them as separate entities.
     
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  15. SantaCarrintonEwingsBells

    SantaCarrintonEwingsBells Soap Chat Addict

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    I think it's implied by Cliff in this alternate universe that Pam, in this world's 1991, is married with children of her own, what if she's married to Mark Graison??

    My fantasy scene in this however is if we see Bobby sitting in a hotel lobby and walking past him is Pam, Pam pauses, Bobby looks up at her, for one moment they connect then we hear a voice say "mommy, hurry daddy is waiting" Pam smiles at Bobby and walks toward her son/daughter and beyond the doors is Mark, Bobby is blown away for a moment but then a mob henchman calls him over.

    If JR had anything to thank Pam for, it was her saving him from a life of debt and hustling.

    Another fantasy scene is we see Gary and Val, already married, living in LA, both very successful in their lives and they comment that Lucy and the grandchildren are visiting this weekend.

    Katherine's life would've been massively different, if Ewing Oil went bankrupt in the late 70s, years before we met Katherine in the original timeline, then Katherine would've been in charge of Wentworth Industries as Pam and Cliff would never have looked for their mother, so Katherine might have had a better life overall if she hadn't of met Bobby or JR.
     
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  16. Piggy It's Kermit Outside

    Piggy It's Kermit Outside Soap Chat Star

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    Very clever division of the show in 3 acts, Rove. Actually it makes me realize that I also see it like that. In fact, I would end the first act when Miss Ellie married Clayton "off screen", which is to me a kind of "jump the shark" moment because the wedding of such a beloved character should have been included in that episode. Everything that follows in "End Game", is a rehash of the Who Shot JR plot, so my second act starts when Bobby and JR return to Ewing Oil and find dear Katherine waiting for the object of his attentions. No matter how fun this scene is (and it is!), but it´s a remake of the scene with Katherine even using the same final threat Kristin used ("This isn´t over yet").
     
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  17. Via The Void

    Via The Void Soap Chat Well-Known Member

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    I'm not a fan of Conundrum, it wasn't the right way to end the show in my opinion.

    It would've been better if they had got Steve Forrest back along with Barbara Bel Geddes & we finally found out that he was indeed Jock Ewing.

    No disrespect intended to the memory of Jim Davis but it would've been a better way to end the show than the travesty which was Conundrum.

    Jock would've returned when he knew he was dying & wanted to be with his family.

    I would've brought back both Linda Gray & Victoria Principal & have them all reunite with Bobby & JR to bring the show to a close.

    The final shot would be Bobby & Pam in a red Mercedes SL driving up the driveway to Southfork with all the family waiting for them. Howard Keel's Clayton hugs Miss Ellie as she says "Goodbye Jock" & the series ends. :)
     
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  18. Ferney

    Ferney Soap Chat Member

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    I can't even deal with it. It was like watching an entirely different show, a bad episode of "Fantasy Island."
     
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  19. Via The Void

    Via The Void Soap Chat Well-Known Member

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    It was a rather lame ending to a once great series. :(
     
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  20. Presea

    Presea Soap Chat Addict

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    We both stop liking it at the same time! How cool is that!?
     

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