Classic Soaps (I'm Still) Watching Another World

Discussion in 'US Soaps Forum' started by Canon, Oct 2, 2016.

  1. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    If you are referring to the secret of who fathered her baby...oh, yes. We are talking Hiroshima-level blowing up in her face. The clever way they plotted the secret becoming known always struck me as Janice reaching out from the grave to continue ruining Mac and Rachel's lives.
     
  2. Jason73

    Jason73 Admin

    Message Count:
    1,549
    Trophy Points:
    2,829
    Location:
    California, USA
    Ratings:
    +2,530
    Medals:
    2
    I had no idea. They hide it well. I've always had a soft spot for Clarice and I'm enjoying her this time around--even though she's not much more than a talk-to at this point. I've read she has a pretty heavy story coming up in the near-ish future. I'm looking forward to see how she does with the material. I'd love to have seen how she did versus Iris when they were fighting over Robert.

    It's interesting because it is a fairly well cast group and yet the writers don't end up making it stick. Then a few years later the show will introduce a similarly wealthy family, the Loves, who manage to make a pretty major impact on the show. I think they managed to integrate the Loves more.

    I really have enjoyed the set up to Mitch's shooting and the way it played out with the prowlers and the stolen ID and the fire in the stables.
     
  3. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    I recall watching this two-day event when it originally aired and didn't like it. Now? It's kind of neat, especially overdressed Iris and all that Sharly foreshadowing...



     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  4. ChrisSumner

    ChrisSumner Soap Chat Active Member

    Message Count:
    199
    Trophy Points:
    3,281
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Ratings:
    +270
    Member Since:
    2001
    I’m in the first week of January 1981 and the show has gone so far downhill since the new writer took over at the beginning of December. In lightening speeding she wrote off almost all of the new characters. I feel that was a mistake in the case of the Holloway family who I would’ve continued developing. The two that remained (Kit and her brother) were the most boring. I also know we’re going to get another Jerry soon and from what I’ve read of his upcoming story I don’t look forward to that.

    One new character I love is Leigh Hobson. Surprisingly he’s played by a Brady kid, Christopher Knight and he’s not a bad dramatic character. Now that I’ve fallen in love with Clarice and Larry I appreciate any attempt to expand their family. Along with Blaine, I feel this is a really strong group of actors and characters.

    Overall I find the show to feel a bit slow in its new pacing. I know we have a Sally recast coming as well as Alice so I’m curious how things will be once they can focus on their own stories. I have to say, the end to the Mitch saga is another disappointment. Killing off Charlie (and mostly keeping Ada off screen) is just shameful. There had to be a better way to get Rachel out. I feel like they’re in a bit of a transition so I’m going to be patient and see how it goes.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Canon

    Canon Soap Chat Fan

    Message Count:
    407
    Trophy Points:
    1,881
    Location:
    Ireland
    Ratings:
    +590
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    Apr 8, 2004
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  6. Canon

    Canon Soap Chat Fan

    Message Count:
    407
    Trophy Points:
    1,881
    Location:
    Ireland
    Ratings:
    +590
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    Apr 8, 2004
    Cast.jpg
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  7. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    For those playing at home, Scott Collishaw (second from right) was a mid-level producer on the show and the 'unofficial historian' the writers went to when they needed info on characters' pasts. Casey Childs (far right) was a longtime director, and Janet Iacobuzio (far left) was a writer and producer at different points in the series. I have no idea who that woman is between Anna Stuart and Scott Collishaw.

    It's also nice to see Amy Carlson hanging out with her ol' gang.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  8. ChrisSumner

    ChrisSumner Soap Chat Active Member

    Message Count:
    199
    Trophy Points:
    3,281
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Ratings:
    +270
    Member Since:
    2001
    I’m now towards the end of May 1981 and the show has stabilized and is very watchable. You could tell the new writers struggled wrapping up the old storylines and dealing with characters they didn’t understand. Once they got their cast in place things started moving fast. With that said, while the show is watchable, it’s not very Another World. It feels more like a bad General Hospital rip off with all the crime and depression throughout the show.

    The positives is that I do like many of the cast changes. Sandy is a revelation and the type of leading man you dream of. He has chemistry with literally everybody he comes into contact with. I look forward to where he goes. The new Sally is fabulous and the perfect wistful heroine that you need on a soap. Marianne has grown on me despite the way she’s written. I feel she suffers from a show that is overall too dark. In a more balanced show I’d be all for her character taking on more of a mans role by using Rick for sex and not really being interested in him. I’m also falling in love with Leigh. It’s a shame they didn’t keep Christopher Knight around.

    Now onto the negative: the darkness! I loved the arena and the Jordan Scott crime story last year because it was balanced. You could sense the threat, but it wasn’t cartoonish. I also liked that the arena could be a place the rich characters could go and get all dolled up. With the new writers you never see the arena beyond Jordan’s office or them being closed. The crime element has taken over. Blaine is being beaten, Jerry’s mother was murdered and left in a field, Tracy was blown up and we never saw Russ grieve. It’s too much. Then you have Jamie raping Cecile out of nowhere and it was treated like an after thought. Worst of all is the destruction of Rachel. After a year of convincing us Mitch was stalking her and doing everything in her power to stay with Mac she’s suddenly in love with him? Huh? Brian tells her that if she stays with Mitch she’ll lose custody of Amanda and she...stays with Mitch? This ain’t the way to revisit her bad girl past.

    Individually these stories could work but I need some light. Tracy and Russ were both good people but they had organic conflict and were interesting. They could be anchors to balance things out but she’s dead and we never see him. I had high hopes for Alice too but she came back so brittle and bitter. I feel this actress would’ve made a better Iris.

    It’s a shame the last full year AOL aired was this one. I’m curious where they go in the other years prior to the SOAPnet run. There’s a scattering of episodes available though so I’ll still watch what I can find. I still find it so wild they had such consistency with Harding Lemay, resented him the entire time and now seem to go through a yearly headwriter change and no clear vision for the show. With better choices Another World would still be ok today.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    You raise a very good point about this period being dark and more crime-oriented. I think a Head Writer in Trouble (wouldn't that be a great film title?) tends to lapse into crime stories and depressing subjects, mainly because it's easier to write. Optimistic, inspiring characters tend to be uninteresting to soap writers, so they either write around them, or put them through the wringer in an effort to "give them shading". The final years of the AW spin-off, Somerset, fell into this trap. It had started as a companion piece to AW--haves and have nots trying to improve their positions in society. But eventually the interesting couples were written out and the writers focused on the seedier side of town with murder mysteries and the like (sending the show into cancellation in 1976). I think crime stories are easier to write with a beginning, middle, and end--rather than the never-ending nature of character-based storylines. A writer applying for a job can pitch such a story much easier than a less-tangible story based on character interactions.
    I'm unsure of who was writing the material you're watching, but I think Corrine Jacker comes along soon after in 1982 and spends a bit more time on developing memorable characters rather than just churning out plot-plot-plot. Her record isn't spotless, but she did dream up Cass Winthrop, Alma Rudder, and Julia Shearer. I'm pretty sure it was Jacker who turned wimpy Cecile into the bitch we all know and love. She also got Jamie to write that roman a clef about the townsfolk that made everyone furious with him.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. ChrisSumner

    ChrisSumner Soap Chat Active Member

    Message Count:
    199
    Trophy Points:
    3,281
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Ratings:
    +270
    Member Since:
    2001
    @Daniel Avery i think L Virginia Browne is writing the show now. Im curious to see her other work and if it was similar. I believe she went to GL as headeriter after AW.

    Right now I’ve reached the Cecile swap and I’ve been anticipating this since she’s one of my favorites. I didn’t expect to like her as quickly as I did but this new actress hit the ground running! I think the original Cecile was fabulous, but the new actress has elevated the characters potential. Whereas the original was softer and a more immature, amateur schemer, the new Cecile is more assertive and determined. I’m not sure if the writing was adjusted with the recast but she’s a lot less passive, particularly with Jaime who was so abusive before. Now instead of just taking it, she’s giving it right back to him. I can’t wait to see more of her!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    Okay, so Cecile's 'turn to the dark side' occurred earlier than I thought. It isn't always successful, but I love it when a soap takes a wimpy or non-descript character and makes them a villain. The best example of this I saw was Barbara Ryan on As the World Turns, who went from put-upon victim to a Bitch on Wheels after having been pushed around for about a decade. Cecile is a strong #2, though...and lord knows you can hand Nancy Frangione just about anything and she'll sell it.

    [​IMG]

    Well, just about anything....:eek::confuse::ms::D
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. ChrisSumner

    ChrisSumner Soap Chat Active Member

    Message Count:
    199
    Trophy Points:
    3,281
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Ratings:
    +270
    Member Since:
    2001
    @Daniel Avery Oh yes. She went from tormenting poor defenseless Pat to the big leagues almost immediately. Drugging Jaime, manipulating Sandy, ruining Maryanne and Rick’s marriage. She came in with goals and I live for her!
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  13. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    The Cecile/Donna rivalry gives me life.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. Jason73

    Jason73 Admin

    Message Count:
    1,549
    Trophy Points:
    2,829
    Location:
    California, USA
    Ratings:
    +2,530
    Medals:
    2
    So I have to admit that I am thoroughly enjoying the Another World novelizations. They are mostly horribly written and in some parts barely more than a plot synopsis and yet I can't stop reading them. I'm currently on the fifth book. I've gone through Rachel's marriage to Russ, her affair with Steve and Jamie's subsequent conception. The last several books have revolved around the Alice-Steve-Rachel triangle. Steve and Alice have married and divorced. Rachel has married and divorced Russ and Ted Clark and in chapters I read last night just lost her bitterly contested divorce hearing versus Steve. She lost mainly thanks to Steve bribing Rachel's dad to testify against her. Iris has also been introduced (married to Eliot Carrington and scheming to get Alice out of Elliot's life) and it was fun to see how her relationship with Rachel starts out--having Alice as a common enemy. I think the next book introduces Mac.

    One of the books also covered Pat's first bout with alcoholism which was especially fun since I'm currently watching episodes of Pat struggling with alcoholism again in 1980.

    The covers are so horribly retro, cheesy romance novel-type covers and I absolutely love them. I can never tell for sure who the characters on the cover are supposed to be though.

    I guess this is supposed to be Steve and Rachel in St. Croix, though Steve isn't blond. Or it might be Russ and Cindy, though they were never in St. Croix.

    [​IMG]


    This, I guess, is supposed to represent Steve and Alice, though they haven't gone to St. Croix in this book, so far.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  15. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    I suppose the publishers had to change the appearance of the "cover couple" to avoid having to pay residuals or royalties to the actors. They were re-stating the stuff other writers had written, so the writers of the source material had to be getting something. The network and/or P&G had to be getting a large cut of the profits, as well--so the last thing they needed was actors demanding a cut simply because their likeness was in the cover art.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  16. Jason73

    Jason73 Admin

    Message Count:
    1,549
    Trophy Points:
    2,829
    Location:
    California, USA
    Ratings:
    +2,530
    Medals:
    2
    Oh, that makes total sense. I hadn't thought of that.

    I was curious how based on the scripts these books are--if the dialogue was lifted directly from them. I found the scene on Youtube where Steve and Alice reconcile in Eliot's apartment while they are unknowingly recorded by Iris' bug. The gist of the actual scene is the same, of course, but the dialogue in the book is not taken directly from the script. It's much better on the actual show. I wonder if that is to avoid having to pay the day to day script writers any money from the books.

    Rachel has been so nasty to Alice in these last couple of books. I wish there was more of Victoria Wyndham playing Rachel from this period on Youtube. I'd like to see it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2019
  17. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    Harding Lemay got a lot of attention from the mainstream press for that plot twist concerning Iris planting listening devices in the apartment. This plotline occurred just as the Watergate scandal was heating up. Lemay had written the storyline before the world found out that Nixon had listening devices (and tapes) in the Oval Office, so at least Lemay couldn't be accused of stealing an idea.
     
  18. Jason73

    Jason73 Admin

    Message Count:
    1,549
    Trophy Points:
    2,829
    Location:
    California, USA
    Ratings:
    +2,530
    Medals:
    2
    I was actually surprised when the listening device was brought up in the book. It seemed so high tech for the period but I hadn't put it in context with Watergate. I guess it also shows how rich Iris was to afford something like that. The funniest part of it was that the listening device was basically just recording conversations. Louise would then transcribe the conversations and take those transcripts to Iris for her perusal. I was picturing poor Louise spending hours and hours listening to nothing, or to the maid cleaning the room, or some boring conversation between Eliot and the housekeeper and having to write it all down.
     
  19. Daniel Avery

    Daniel Avery Super Moderator Staff Member

    Message Count:
    2,715
    Trophy Points:
    5,327
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    Ratings:
    +4,897
    Medals:
    3
    Member Since:
    June 10, 2000
    It was driving me nuts, trying to recall where I'd read about the Watergate/Iris connection, so I dug it up:

    MLH: Watergate and Vietnam were major historical events during the seventies. You created a story where Iris is bugging her husband's hotel suite before they found the Watergate tapes. How could you know?
    LEMAY: I didn't. I just figured that was an interesting story and I got a call from the Wall Street Journal. They did a whole piece about it, asking me when I wrote it. I said the script had been taped ten days earlier meaning I had written it three weeks before and they were amazed.

    MLH: How did you invent a situation using the latest technology?
    LEMAY: As a writer, you ask, "What do they want and how do they get it?" "How far will they go?" She wanted evidence that he was sleeping with Alice.

    Read the whole thing here (but pay no attention to that part about Jill Farren Phelps--he obviously was having a bout of temporary insanity):

    http://iriswheeler.tripod.com/sodonline1997.html
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  20. ChrisSumner

    ChrisSumner Soap Chat Active Member

    Message Count:
    199
    Trophy Points:
    3,281
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Ratings:
    +270
    Member Since:
    2001
    I'm reaching the end of the early 80s AOL run in October 1981. Overall this has been the worst of what I've watched, with bright spots here and there. As the year winds down its finally getting good and of course thats where episodes stop! Youtube has playlists for all the years, but 82-84 last I checked average around 30 episodes a year. Better than nothing, but I wish I could've seen them fully.

    For months they've been building towards Steve Frame's return as the mysterious Edward Black sets up shop in Bay City. Right now Jamie suddenly went out of town causing Rachel to go to his boss' apartment and running into Steve. So far Ada thinks she's crazy and the man who works for him denied it's Steve Frame. I didn't expect that type of reveal. I figured they'd wait and have everybody meet him in a grand fashion, but having her bump into him was shocking and very effective. I feel like with Mitch away they're finally getting back to a Rachel I can enjoy. On the other side of town I must say I HATE Alice with Mac. This recast Alice is one of the most vacant actors I've ever seen. The other Alice was a bit too hard, but that was down to how she was written. I can't imagine how they could cast such a limited actress to act against such strong actors like Douglass Watson, Victoria Wyndham and David Canary. It's baffling. Hell, instead of wasting Tina Sloan on Olivia they could've made her Alice.

    For you all that know AW better than I do, how was David Canary received as Steve? It's crazy for me knowing his work on AMC that he only lasted a couple years. Such a strong and popular actor and he didn't last? It's crazy to me. So far I do enjoy him in the role. I wish regardless of what happened they hadn't killed him off. It's a big pet peeve of mine to kill off the same character multiple times.
     

Share This Page